Just how perfect are your short rows?

[ladydemetreis]

Originally Posted by CraftyMommaOf2

when someone says the purl one they mean the one that they wrapped on the purl side. you'll knit them both when you go around.


*disclaimer: that's my understanding! *

TY!! I always thought I was doing it backwards somehow?

[Ruth]

On the first really closeup pic one is 9 rows from the left and 1.5 sts in in the caramel sort of colour, the other is 8 rows from the right and 4 sts in in the brown colour. On the bottom pic one is 8 rows from left and 4.5sts in in the red colour and one is 8 rows from the right and 6.5 sts in in the dusty pink colour.

[Ruth]

Just quoting myself so the pic ends up next to the explanation. I'll take a pic of the inside later today but no there isn't any slack with this way Julia and hardly anything to see on the inside.

Originally Posted by mrsflipmode

OK I had to try and get some pictures now but they're not very good so I might try in daylight tomorrow so I don't have to use the flash.

Here's one side of the back of some pants, the short rows are every 6 rows and moving in 1 stitch each time:


Attempted closeup of purl end (rhs of butt as you look at it) there are 2 on here:


The knit ends of the same 2:

[averymybaby]

dear god, woman. you have been holding out on us, you expert! looks beautiful. sigh. i'm trying like 8 different ways on this one pair of pants, and so far i like yours the best! the japanese method just made me angry

[averymybaby]

Originally Posted by mrsflipmode

My personal method is to get to the end of the short row and just turn (without wrapping the next stitch) then slip the following stitch and knit to the other end of the short row where I do the same thing.

You mean purl to the other end, right? then turn back knitwise, slip, and knit back?

When coming back to the short row now, when I'm knitting in the round it's quite easy, I slip the last stitch of the short row (the previously slipped one) to the right needle and pick up the stitch below it

The stitch below on the RIGHT needle or the LEFT needle?

then pass both back to the left needle. Knit the slipped stitch as normal

don't knit it with anything?

then knit the one below with the stitch across the gap thus closing the gap.

here i am not sure which the "stitch across the gap" is.. is it the next one on the left needle?

When coming back around to the one at the end of the purl row of the short row it's a bit more difficult, I slip the stitch before the end of the short row to the right needle reversing it's direction as I do so then pick up the stitch below the previously slipped stitch (which is the next stitch on the left needle) and place it on the left needle then slip back the now reversed stitch across the gap. Knit the stitch across the gap with the stitch below the slipped stitch Through the Back of the Loops then continue knitting as usual. 'Et voila' - virtually invisible short rows (like I really struggle to find mine now on the right side).

It is hard to figure out which way to mount the slipped stitch (backwards), and you have to pick up the next stitch on the left needle backwards too, yes? and then K2TBL? I actually think I got this correct, but I'm having a hard time remebering what I did.

They're still not perfect, but this is so much better than the wrap method. After a bit (much less!) of redistribution, these are going to LOOK 10 x better than mine with the wrap method, I can tell.

Thanks Ruth for letting me pick your brain

[JustLookin]

Ruth that sounds like the Japanese short row method. Is it?

[JustLookin]

here is a pic of my most recent soaker w/ shortrows. I totally forgot to redistribute on that one side so its more noticable than usual.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...s/shortrow.jpg

its easy to pick out where the SRs are in this one cause the colors of the yarn doubling over themselves give it away

[Ruth]

Originally Posted by averymybaby

You mean purl to the other end, right? then turn back knitwise, slip, and knit back?

Yes, purl - what you said there.


The stitch below on the RIGHT needle or the LEFT needle?

It's the stitch below the slipped stitch when you have it on the right needle then you transfer both back to the left needle.

don't knit it with anything?

exactly, then you knit the stitch you picked up from below with the next stitch along.



here i am not sure which the "stitch across the gap" is.. is it the next one on the left needle?

Yep.



It is hard to figure out which way to mount the slipped stitch (backwards),

yes, backwards so it isn't twisted when you ktbl.

and you have to pick up the next stitch on the left needle backwards too, yes?

no, you can leave this one the right way round - all we're trying to do is cover it with the other stitch

and then K2TBL? I actually think I got this correct, but I'm having a hard time remebering what I did.

They're still not perfect, but this is so much better than the wrap method. After a bit (much less!) of redistribution, these are going to LOOK 10 x better than mine with the wrap method, I can tell.

I still have to give them a little wiggle just to make sure the picked up stitch is hidden behind the proper stitch when they're knitted together but it's pretty easy to do.

Thanks Ruth for letting me pick your brain

Sara, I'm not sure if it's exactly the same as Japanese short rows, I thought they were the ones where you have to use a paperclip and mark the loop as you turn and pick that one up later? Basically when we did the P-pants class and had all the discussion with Pam about various methods I tried them all and fiddled around with them til I found a way that I find easy and can remember so I'm sure it's not original I just unvented it for myself .

eta: I just checked out the Japanese short rows and they are a bit different because you're knitting a different loop with the stitch across the gap but apart from that they're the same.

[Ruth]

Originally Posted by JustLookin

here is a pic of my most recent soaker w/ shortrows. I totally forgot to redistribute on that one side so its more noticable than usual.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v5...s/shortrow.jpg

its easy to pick out where the SRs are in this one cause the colors of the yarn doubling over themselves give it away

Those are fantastic too

[JustLookin]

Id love to see pics of your method. Im very happy with my first SR stitch but the second one I still have to distribute the yarn next to it. I know this has to do with how I knit and that slack gets pushed up to it, its annoying.

[Perogi]

Ruth, I'd love to see pics too. I'm so visual that it's hard for me to follow instructions like that...but I will TRY on my next pair of pants! Your short rows are beautiful!!!

[Ruth]

No probs, I'll knit a swatch later and try to take pics.

[averymybaby]

major karma to ruth!

[Ruth]

OK guys, you asked for it so here goes - lots of pictures to follow so leave now if you're not patient enough .

I've put markers on because usually I'd use markers to locate the ends of the short rows as directed in most patterns and it makes it much easier to see where the 'stitch across the gap' is.

So knit to one stitch before first marker, turn and slip first stitch purlwise


this leaves a visible gap where you've turned


purl to one stitch before second marker, turn and slip first stitch purlwise (again you'll have a visible gap where you've turned).


When you get back to just before the last stitch of the short row i.e. 2 stitches before the first marker


slip the next stitch to the right needle purlwise


pick up the stitch below the stitch on the right needle with the left needle


Then pass the stitch on the right needle back to the left


knit this stitch as normal


then knit the next stitch (the picked up one) together with the 'stitch across the gap' which is the next stitch on the needle


so you end up with something which looks like this


Now when you come back around to the second marker slip the first stitch after the marker knitwise to the right needle


thus reversing its mount


pick up the stitch below the next stitch on the left needle


and place it on the left needle


pass the slipped stitch back to the left needle


knit this stitch together with the picked up stitch through the back of the loops


knit the next stitch normally and you should end up with something like this


And that's basically it. You may have to fiddle with the stitches a little bit to make sure that the picked up stitch is covered by the real stitch but it's really very easy to do. When knitting flat it's a bit more complicated but as long as you remember you want the real stitch the right way round so if you knit it tbl you need to reverse it first you can't go far wrong (I usually end up having a couple of goes before I get it right because I just don't do it as often).

Oh and I didn't knit a massive swatch I just chucked it into the cardigan I'm working on then ripped it out again afterwards lol.

[jenniebug]

wow thats pretty cool! I was wondering how to turn without leaving a gap and without wrapping. You just totally cleared it up for me. I may try this in my next project!

[ladydemetreis]

Wow, ty Ruth! I was getting a little confused with all the type, but got it and will try it on my next soaker I make!!!

[Perogi]

Thank you so much! I hope that my battle with short rows has ended. The pictures make it so much clearer for me - I really appreciate it Ruth! :

[Jewel]

thank you, I will have to try it next time

[averymybaby]

Ruth I could kiss you!

[IrishBaby]

Thanks for taking the time to post all those pics!